Something I've always had difficulty with was telling the difference between goblins and Orcs. The texts seem to indicate that goblins and orcs are the same thing, but I'm not so sure. They are described in such a way in the Hobbit that seems to suggest they are not Orcs, or at least smaller and built differently. They don't seem to exactly match your typical description of "Orc". Yet throughout the works, we also hear the terms "goblin-men" and "half-orcs". I understand the difference between Orcs and the Uruk-Hai. I'd be inclined to think that Tolkien's replacement of the word "orc" with "goblins" in the Hobbit was only to make the reading more digestible for children, but the word is used interchangeably other places also.
I saw the other thread debating their origins, which is a larger topic, but mine is pretty straightforward: Are Orcs and goblins one and the same?
As far as I know orcs and goblins are the same creatures. I know the Hobbit was written long before the LoTR series and Silmarillion and so goblins may have been one of his earliest thoughts on what would later become orcs. Uruk and Uruk-Hai are just elvish (?) names for orcs and great orcs.
So yes, goblins and orcs are the same creatures.
-- Edited by Celethil at 02:11, 2006-09-30
__________________
Therefore I say that we will go on, and this doom I add: the deeds that we shall do shall be the matter of song until the last days of Arda
TSF - There is another thread "Difference between orcs and goblins" which goes much further in detail.
After reading that thread I see that I made a mistake. The Uruks were the great orcs devised by Sauron and the Uruk-Hai are the great orcs devised by Saruman that could withstand daylight.
Uruk is a word in the Black Speech for great orc.
There is still no apparent difference between orcs and goblins. Although Anduril may have a point. I don't see why orcs would develop much differently than Men, so that there would probably be variances in orcs by region. Entirely speculation on my part.
__________________
Therefore I say that we will go on, and this doom I add: the deeds that we shall do shall be the matter of song until the last days of Arda
In the other thread The Might quoted the best answer in my opinion, but here is the fuller version, and another quote to go along with it.
'This is a story of long ago. At that time the languages and letters were quite different from ours today. English is used to represent the languages. But two points may be noted. (1) In English the only correct plural of dwarf is dwarfs, and the adjective is dwarfish. In this story dwarves and dwarvish are used, but only when speaking of the ancient people to whom Thorin Oakenshield and his companions belonged. (2) Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin (or hobgoblin for the larger kinds). Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork, applied to sea-animals of dolphin-kind.' JRRT The Hobbit
And, from JRRT's Notes on Nomenclature, made to assist translators of the book into other languages.
Orc This is supposed to be the Common Speech name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated to English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained.'
So it's about translation: Quendi 'Elves' Orc 'goblin'. It's sort of like as if someone was translating a German story into English, a tale in which dogs played a part. The translator himself liked the word hund better than 'dog' however, and so he began to leave hund as it was in the English version; that is, he did not translate it much. In The Lord of the Rings the idea (as I read it anyway) is that JRRT often left Orc, but usually translated it (or had already done so anyway) in The Hobbit.
