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Topic: Andilar

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Chief Maiar
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Posts: 375
Date: Apr 17, 2006
Andilar

Has anyone heard of Andilar, or know where it lies. I have been listening to a song called Silver Ships of Andilar, which I know must be Tolkien based since it speaks of Valinor though I know not what or where it is about. One theory I have is that it is a song written from the perspective of the Numenoreans that set sail to wage war on Valinor since it speaks not kindly about the place and all the ships get destroyed. So if anyone knows if Andilar is on Numenor or where it is I'd be most appreciative.

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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: Apr 17, 2006
Andilar has absolutely nothing to do with the world of Tolkien.
"Van Zandt was a self-destructive type, with a lot of genius and a lot of problems. He gets compared to Hank Williams a lot. He believed that songs just came to him, but that to get them he had to let go everything but his guitar: family, money, whatever. Between that and some psychiatric problems, he had a hard life and not a long one. But he left a whole lot of music behind. He was capable of writing absolutely spare music and lyrics, saying nothing at all more than what needed to be said."
this is from a desciption of Townes Van Zandt, the one who made the song.
also fro the same source:
"And, since he wrote when he did, I think there may also have been some influence from Tolkien, at least in this song:The Silver Ships of Andilar"
his influence is clear, and it would be har to associate Andilar with any place in ME...
From a comment made by the artist himself:
"This is my folk epic. Warriors against dire odds and maidens a-watching the keep. It comes from reading too many Lin Carter editions, I'm sure. It took thirty-six hours and an entire legal pad to get it on paper. I'd like to see Tiny Tim Record it."
But the fact the song is about a company of Men does make me think the only possibility is Numenor. Perhaps it is associated with the fact the Numeroneans tried more and more to reach Valinor, and the eventually did under Ar-Pharazon.
Also it could be associated with the story of Tar-Amandil sailing with some Men towards Valinor to try and save his people.

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Honor, Freedom, Fatherland
Elves of the Third Age - Rank 1
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Date: May 17, 2006
North for the shores of Valinor
The hills
did turn from green to blue
(taken from the song)
Well I don't carry any Tolkien Maps (unfortunately) so I can't tell much but it does look like he meant that he was in Valinor then left for... (i really don't know) and then wanted to come back to Valinor, unless I didn't read it correctly.

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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: May 17, 2006
no...as I said
it looks like Andilar was associated with Numenor
Tar-Amandil for example did build a ship and tried to find Valinor, but with no hope, just like in the song.
but of course...we can never know
anyway, I doubt it has anything to do with Tolkien's ideas...the song was only ispired by Tolkien's work

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Anarion, Son of Elendil - rank 8
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Date: Jun 1, 2006

It was not known if Amandil made it to Valinor TM. He probably did as the Valar were well aware of all the plans of the Numenoreans. He probably did make it, though he may have perished for it.



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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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hmm...I think I said the same
I said we don't know if he made it

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Anarion, Son of Elendil - rank 8
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Date: Jun 1, 2006

"Tar-Amandil for example did build a ship and tried to find Valinor, but with no hope, just like in the song."


That sounds conclusive I think TM.



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Utúlie'n  aurë!  Aiya  Eldalië  ar  Atanatári,  utúlie'n  aurë! 
Auta  i  lómë! 
Aurë entuluva!

Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: Jun 1, 2006
"Tar-Amandil for example did build a ship and tried to find Valinor, but with no hope, just like in the song.
but of course...we can never know"

next time you quote, quote it all

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Anarion, Son of Elendil - rank 8
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Date: Jun 1, 2006
You say 'But with no hope'. That means that Amandil had no hope. Had you put 'But its doubtful' then that is valid.

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Utúlie'n  aurë!  Aiya  Eldalië  ar  Atanatári,  utúlie'n  aurë! 
Auta  i  lómë! 
Aurë entuluva!

Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: Jun 1, 2006
I know what I meant by that and you don't
and actually why do you keep analysing what I said ?
no better things to do on the forums?


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Honor, Freedom, Fatherland
Anarion, Son of Elendil - rank 8
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Date: Jun 1, 2006
I simply correct any mistakes you make. No problem in that. You can do the same to me if it really bothers you.

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Utúlie'n  aurë!  Aiya  Eldalië  ar  Atanatári,  utúlie'n  aurë! 
Auta  i  lómë! 
Aurë entuluva!

Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: Jun 1, 2006
ok, but that was a little far away
if I said we don't know and I said what I meant by that you should show a little understanding and believe me on that.
after all we aren't here to correct small things, or the way we express ourselves

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Anarion, Son of Elendil - rank 8
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Posts: 2161
Date: Jun 1, 2006

Ok. Its just sometimes I notice that something you firstly state in a post you often say the opposite later on in that post or later on in the topic.


Anyway over to the other threads.



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Utúlie'n  aurë!  Aiya  Eldalië  ar  Atanatári,  utúlie'n  aurë! 
Auta  i  lómë! 
Aurë entuluva!

Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
Status: Offline
Posts: 3118
Date: Jun 1, 2006
I agree.

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