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Topic: Worst Scene(s) in the movie ?

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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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Date: Dec 29, 2006
Worst Scene(s) in the movie ?

This topic comes as a simple answer to my other thread featuring the best scene(s) of LOTR.
Tyrhael's post reminded me that the films are nice, but they of course have their bad parts...so please feel free to discuss them here.

I'll start by naming my #1 most hated movie scene - the duel between Gandalf and the WK. So filled with tension and excitement while reading it in the book, I was very, very ,very disappointed to see Gandalf thrown of his horse and having his staff broken in the movie. Clearly in the books breaking the staff of a wizard was a scene of clear defeat. We see Gandalf do this to Saruman...but the WK doing it to Gandalf...And Shadowfax, greatest of horses, can do nothing more then throw the wizard and Pippin off his back...compared to his description in the book he is nothing in the film...
such a shame that this was done...

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Elf of Rivendell - Rank 2
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Worst parts?
Legolas' reduction into skateboarding eye-candy.
Gimli's reduction into gross comic relief, for example burping at Théoden, "ripe meat off the bone", etc. ... and the "natural sprinters" line when in fact Dwarves were known for their endurance and strength.
Frodo's "wimpifying", always tripping, always needing to be saved by other people.
Aragorn's "angstifying".
Galadriel becoming a green glowing figure of DOOM, with no emphasis on her personal test and victory.
Some of the abysmal pronunciation of names by characters within the films.
THE PORTRAYAL OF SAURON AS A FLOATING EYE!
Théoden's possession by Saruman, and his undignified end in the movies as opposed to dying after having killed many of the enemy (including a leader) as in the books.
Faramir's decision to seize Frodo and the Ring and bring them to Osgiliath.
Treebeard and the Ents initially deciding not to go to Isengard.
Some of the "Elvish" translations used within the film.
The pointless and boring Aragorn-falls-off-the-cliff scene in TTT.
Denethor being reduced to stubborn insanity.
Gandalf hitting Denethor with his staff and seizing control!
Denethor refusing to light the Beacons.
Denethor flambé.... he didn't have to run all the way off the thing (and probably couldn't have MADE it that entire way!)
The addition of the Elves at Helm's Deep... made the sacrifice by the Men who lost their lives seem less noble.
Frodo and Gollum actually fighting for the Ring at Sammath Naur.
Cutting of the Scouring of the Shire (I mean, it's _essential_ to the theme!)
Cutting of the Voice of Saruman
No explanation of WHY Frodo was going into the West, i.e. that he had failed, and had been finally corrupted by the Ring, and his physical (i.e. Shelob and the Witch-king) and spiritual wounds were too grave to be healed in Middle-earth
And so on, and so forth. I could go on all day, but I haven't seen the movies or read the books for ages, so I'm going from memory here of _only_ the things that I can remember.

Edit: How could I forget the "Scrubbing Bubbles" fluorescent green ghosts? They shouldn't have looked like that, and more importantly, their ownly weapon was fear, and they shouldn't have shown up at Pelennor but only at Pelargir; once again, they served as a deus ex machina that undermined the importance of the nobility and bravery of the sacrifices that _men_ had made at that battle, i.e. giving their lives.

And Gandalf's sudden lack of power before the Witch-king, staff-breaking and all, was simply irritating. I suspect I'll come up with more ideas as time goes on.

-- Edited by Tyrhael at 03:15, 2006-12-29

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Black Numenorean - Rank 3
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Tyrhael wrote:


Edit: How could I forget the "Scrubbing Bubbles" fluorescent green ghosts? They shouldn't have looked like that, and more importantly, their ownly weapon was fear, and they shouldn't have shown up at Pelennor but only at Pelargir; once again, they served as a deus ex machina that undermined the importance of the nobility and bravery of the sacrifices that _men_ had made at that battle, i.e. giving their lives.

And Gandalf's sudden lack of power before the Witch-king, staff-breaking and all, was simply irritating. I suspect I'll come up with more ideas as time goes on.

-- Edited by Tyrhael at 03:15, 2006-12-29




Tyrhael,


      I've got to agree with you on that..."the ghosts on Pelenor". According to the film, why would Aragorn release them on Pelenor, when they would have made short work of all the Orcs in front of the Black Gates.


      I also agree about the staff breaking by the WK. Sort of shows Gandalf as totally powerless in front of the WK....  No, No, No!!


Fred



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I am Anduril, who was Narsil. Let the thralls of Mordor fear me.
Samwise Gamgee - rank 9
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Date: Dec 29, 2006

Alot of things there Tyrhael. Some are justly spoken some are not.


For example even in the book Denethor was quite mad and stubborn nearer the end. Pippin even says 'Denethor has lost his mind...'


As for the Elves at helm's deep. Thats up to personal taste. I prefered it to the battle of the Hornburg in the book becuase Elves being there seemed to make the whole affair seem 'a bigger deal'. However it could have been done more realistically. You get the immpression that the Elves are sent from Rivendell the same time the Uruks leave Isengard, and somehow the Elves arrive first???


As to the Ents. I can only suppose that PJ wanted to show the audience first that the Ents, like the Eagles, were a sort of 'last resort' and could only be used at the end of need. Thus is why it takes Treebeard seeing the dead burnt tree feild to really enrage him.


As to gandalf losing against the Witchking I agree it was completely inaccurate but I know why it was done:


Th Balrog was defeated and everyone knew that Sauron would not actually truelly come back so there was no one left who could surpass Gandalf's power. So instead of making it seem as though the goodies had the best guy he thought he would give the Witchking more power to defeat him, so the audience went once again 'Oh no Gandalf will die!'.


Tyrhael: I recommend seeing This Thread about the Eye of Sauron.



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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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I agree with you on those points Tyrhael, though I must admit I like seeing the movie and it is much easier for me to criticise it while I am not looking or reading the books.

1) The earthquake and crack caused by the fall of Barad-Dûr
Just consider the scene of the battle of Morannon. Somehow the land cracks just between the heroes and the baddies, even circling the heroes who are surrounded by enemies, to safety. In my opinion that is one of the most ridiculous scenes in the whole movies. I understand it must have been difficult to show the sudden fall of Sauron's army, but that wasn't a very good way of doing it.

2) Elves in Helm's Deep
And that was a totally unnecessary one!
I admit it can be debated whether it's a deus ex machina at all, since the Elves don't provide a very easy victory, just victory.

3) Arwen
Arwen who saves Aragorn from drowning. Admitted, this is not a proper deus ex machina, because Arwen is not there to save Aragorn from drowning, but Aragorn is drowning for Arwen to save him.

4) The Army of the Dead at Minas Tirith
Really had no point...just as in the case of the Elves at Helm's Deep the presence of the Army of the Dead did nothing more but to completely wipe out the valour and the courage showed in the book by the Gondorians from the southern fiefdoms.

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Black Numenorean - Rank 3
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Forgive me, but I didn't see it as Arwen saving Aragorn from drowning. I see it as Aragorn was about to fall, and Arwen brought him back from the brink.

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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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The Might wrote:

Admitted, this is not a proper deus ex machina, because Arwen is not there to save Aragorn from drowning, but Aragorn is drowning for Arwen to save him.



I did see it like that as well, but I consider it among the deus ex machina examples as well.

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Honor, Freedom, Fatherland
Elf of Rivendell - Rank 2
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Well, at least they didn't have XenArwen at Helm's Deep or Sauron appearing at the Black Gate (and Aragorn stabbing him just as the Ring was destroyed, further taking the 'credit' away from Frodo), like they were planning to.

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Witchking of Angmar - Rank 10
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indeed, I also heard that Sauron was supposed to come as Aragorn asked him to come forth...

anyway, as far as actors are concerned I would aword the price of worst actor in the movie to..*drum roll* the guy who plays Celeborn
he is TERRIBLE

"tell me where is Gandalf for I much desire to speak with him"
nothing agains people with another sexual orientation but Celeborn sounds like a homosexual in that scene...no manhood in him at all...more metrosexual then Legolas
I hate that line even more then the famous "They're taking the hobbits to Isengard" or "A Balrog of Morgoth"

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Samwise Gamgee - rank 9
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Tyrhael - are you from the plaza? You seem to have a very 'Elenhir' point of view about many things.
Tell me do you think Morgoth was dead after he was cast into The Void?

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mouth of sauron wrote:







As for the Elves at helm's deep. Thats up to personal taste. I prefered it to the battle of the Hornburg in the book becuase Elves being there seemed to make the whole affair seem 'a bigger deal'. However it could have been done more realistically. You get the immpression that the Elves are sent from Rivendell the same time the Uruks leave Isengard, and somehow the Elves arrive first???


 


As for the elves arriving first, they came from Lorien, but still i cant see how they made it there first.


 


And does the sub-forum inscription not say this is for threads besides movies?



-- Edited by Olorin/Gandalf at 13:23, 2007-01-18

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Loremaster Elf of Mirkwood - Rank 4
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Tyrhael what I see in your first post is just changings brought by Jackson to the movies not ncessarily worst scenes in the movies. Are you sure you posted the message in the right place? Some changings in my opinion are better than the books, Haldir coming into the aid of men, Frodo's need to be saved by other people are just some examples.
Sorry for off posting, is not really in my habbit but I had to make my point somehow.

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